Thursday 29 April 1993

Election of Chair

Election of Vice-Chair

Appointment of subcommittee

Committee business


*Chair / Président: Johnson, Paul R. (Prince Edward-Lennox-South Hastings/Prince Edward-Lennox-Hastings-Sud ND)

*Vice-Chair / Vice-Président: Wiseman, Jim (Durham West/-Ouest ND)

Caplan, Elinor (Oriole L)

Carr, Gary (Oakville South/-Sud PC)

*Cousens, W. Donald (Markham PC)

Ferguson, Will, (Kitchener ND)

Jamison, Norm (Norfolk ND)

Kwinter, Monte (Wilson Heights L)

Mathyssen, Irene (Middlesex ND)

*North, Peter (Elgin ND)

*Phillips, Gerry (Scarborough-Agincourt L)

Sutherland, Kimble (Oxford ND)

*In attendance / présents

Substitutions present / Membres remplaçants présents:

Klopp, Paul (Huron ND) for Mrs Mathyssen

Wilson, Gary (Kingston and The Islands/Kingston et Les Îles ND) for Mr Ferguson

Clerk / Greffière: Grannum, Tonia

Staff / Personnel: Campbell, Elaine, research officer, Legislative Research Service

The committee met at 1008 in committee room 1.


Clerk of the Committee (Ms Tonia Grannum): Honourable members, it is my duty to call upon you to elect a Chair, and I'll receive nominations.

Mr Jim Wiseman (Durham West): I nominate Paul Johnson.

Clerk of the Committee: Are there any further nominations?

Mr W. Donald Cousens (Markham): I move nominations be closed.

Clerk of the Committee: Okay, there being no further nominations, I declare Mr Johnson active as Chair.


The Chair (Mr Paul Johnson): I think it's wonderful to be in the chair and have such a knowledgeable clerk to assist me and, indeed, I have my next direction.

Therefore, I say, honourable members, may I have the names for the election of Vice-Chair?

Mr Peter North (Elgin): I nominate Jim Wiseman for Vice-Chair.

The Chair: Any further nominations? Consider nominations closed. Congratulations, Mr Wiseman.

Mr Wiseman: Thanks to my nominee.

Mr Gerry Phillips (Scarborough-Agincourt): We are on three already.

The Chair: I plan to run a tight ship and an efficient one as well.


The Chair: Now we have to select subcommittee members. Is there an official jargon I'm supposed to use for this?

Clerk of the Committee: Do we know who will be on the subcommittee?

Mr Cousens: I'd like to nominate Mr Gary Carr.

Mr Phillips: I think I probably will. Can you nominate yourself in this business?

Mr Cousens: I'll nominate Mr Gerry Phillips.

Mr Paul Klopp (Huron): A wise choice.

Mr Wiseman: I think I'm there now as Vice-Chair.

The Chair: I think then that it's clear that Gary Carr and Gerry Phillips, and Jim, you have a motion?

Mr Wiseman: I have a motion establishing a subcommittee on business. I move that a subcommittee on committee business be appointed to meet from time to time at the call of the Chair or at the request of any member thereof to consider and report to the committee on the business of the committee; that substitution be permitted on the subcommittee; that the presence of all members of the subcommittee is necessary to constitute a meeting; and that the subcommittee be composed of the following members: Mr Johnson (Chair), Mr Wiseman, Mr Carr and Mr Phillips.

On this motion, just for clarification from the clerk, I understand that with a motion it could be possible to have subcommittee meetings without all of the members in attendance.

The Chair: It's an amendable motion.

Mr Wiseman: Then I would move its adoption.

The Chair: All those in favour of the motion? Mr Cousens, Mr Phillips, are you in favour of the motion?

Mr Phillips: Yes.

Mr Cousens: Agreed.

The Chair: It's unanimous.


The Chair: We've come to agenda item 4 under the organization of the standing committee on finance and economic affairs. I think, for those of us who were on the committee previously, we were dealing with Bill 164, and it is our expectation that we will continue to deal with that. The clerk has a package that she's going to share with all committee members. For those of you who haven't previously been on the committee you might find it an important document to review, and for those who were on the committee previously you too might find it an important document to review for our forthcoming meetings.

If there's no further business, I would entertain a motion to adjourn.

Mr Wiseman: Are we adjourning till this afternoon or till next week?

The Chair: Till next week.

Mr Wiseman: Then I would move.

Mr Cousens: Excuse me. Do you know what we're going to do next week, Mr Chair?

The Chair: To the best of my knowledge, we're going to be dealing with 164. Maybe I could ask the clerk for more direction with regard to this.

It's all explained in the memorandum, Mr Cousens. We left off with Bill 164 in clause-by-clause and, as you may recall, we weren't advancing expeditiously with regard to that, so I think, as the memo states, we'll be dealing with that further.

Mr Phillips: Could the subcommittee meet, Mr Chairman, just to try and order our business a little bit for us? I think we're just getting back up to speed here.

The Chair: Indeed, I think it would be a fair move to have a subcommittee meeting at some point previous to our next full meeting.

Mr Phillips: My instincts, just thinking out loud, are to do it early next week, and then each of us would have a chance to chat a bit with our caucuses about it.

The Chair: I think that's probably wise. We could do it today, but I don't think any of us would have time to review the package we've had placed before us, so maybe we could have an agreement as to some time next week to meet prior to the next full meeting.

Mr Phillips: Probably Tuesdays are good, I think, some time, if we can jam it in. At least, that's my instinct.

Mr Cousens: Try for Monday. Then you can do it at caucus for Tuesday.

Mr Wiseman: Have the subcommittee meeting on Tuesday. We can deal with this in caucus before that. I assume you have caucus meetings Tuesday mornings as well.

Mr Phillips: Yes, we do.

Mr Cousens: Do you still have a caucus or are they all breaking up?

The Chair: If we could stick to the business of just trying to establish a time we're all agreeable to early in the week.

How about if we adjourn and we can continue this discussion off the record and establish a time when we can meet? This meeting is adjourned until next Thursday morning at 10 o'clock.

The committee adjourned at 1016.